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Post by nogle on Dec 6, 2015 20:32:33 GMT -5
Me too, I loved the chase mission where the terrain moved each turn. Real sense of speed
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Post by commissarkrad on Dec 14, 2015 22:47:17 GMT -5
Very excited for this. I am a huge fan of Mordhiem and Battlefleet Gothic!
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Post by grubnards on Dec 15, 2015 1:11:59 GMT -5
While the announcement of GW bringing back specialist games sounds great, going by GW's track record of late I am a bit worried about this. First of all, it sounds like the forge world team is heading this up so look for great products but going for a ton of money. Secondly, do you really think that they will release the games based on previous incarnation? Maybe I'm getting too old and this is the cynic in me but I see this as a quick way by GW to capitalize on nostalgia. My guess is that the new games that they will be launching will be one-shot type of games with very little follow up support. I really can't see them going back to creating new lines of stock for Battle Fleet Gothic, Mordheim Crews, Necromunda crews, Epic armies, Warmaster armies, Inquisitor, etc...
The last few years they have repeatedly said that they are a models company, not a game company. So why would they do an about face and create or revise several old rule sets when they can't even properly manage their one main cash cow, 40k? How many of you really think that they will bring back 5-6 new game systems with the intention of fully supporting the rules with periodic FAQs and updates when they can't even do it for their 2 current games? I really can't see this in any other way than a quick money grab on their behalf and delivering a half-assed group of games that will never be supported.
They have long missed the boat by letting their specialist games die out. Too many other companies have since come in and capitalized on the vacuum they created. You want fleet battles? Try Armada, Xwing, Attack Wing, Firestorm Armada, and Dropfleet Commander. You want skirmish type fantasy games? Try Frostgrave (really fun game), Wrath of Kings, Shieldbreaker, Age of Sigmar, and hoardes. As for sci-fi skirmish games you can find a ton of them from a bunch of different companies ranging from apocalyptic futures, dystopian settings, and future tech. Most of these games are well supported by the companies that make them and in many cases a low cost entry to the game. The only thing that GW has going for them if their IP. Most of us have grown up with GW so in the past we naturally gravitated towards their products. But will people new to the gaming scene and with limited of no knowledge of GW's IP be so keen on dropping a few hundred dollars to start up a skirmish game when there are so many alternatives out there now?
So, while i'd love to see these games brought back I just can't see GW doing them justice like their previous versions.
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Post by dudeisuck on Dec 15, 2015 1:23:16 GMT -5
Don't just rain on this parade, drown the crap out of it, Kevin...
Eh, I could see them doing it like a one shot, but at the same time, they said betrayal at calth will not be a one-run game, so I think they may actually do it similar to that, have the game, but you can use the models to do what you want. The fact that the model range may be coming back out is really what entices me.
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Post by grubnards on Dec 15, 2015 2:08:58 GMT -5
Don't just rain on this parade, drown the crap out of it, Kevin... Eh, I could see them doing it like a one shot, but at the same time, they said betrayal at calth will not be a one-run game, so I think they may actually do it similar to that, have the game, but you can use the models to do what you want. The fact that the model range may be coming back out is really what entices me. ha, sorry about that garner The thing about Betrayal of Calth is, how many people are rushing out to buy it just to play the game "as is" in the box other than Nogle? I've seriously considered picking up a box to augment my Word Bearers but then I remembered that GW hates Chaos Marines and Chaos Marine players by making their units and codex suck balls. Yeah I get it that its a "great deal" for someone who wants to start 30k or add more units to their existing 40k armies so the fact the its not a "one-run" game doesn't matter. They are banking on that players will scoop up the big boxed sets to use the miniatures in their 40k games. Same with the Assassin game, over $100 plus dollars for 4 unique assassin models and some repackaged cultists and marines. Again, other than Nogle, how many people bought the game to play as is? Space Hulk ring a bell? How many people (other than Nogle) rushed out to buy the "limited edition" game just to get their hands on the unique models and then shelve the rest of the game? Then GW did the ultimate dick move and re-released Space Hulk for the masses after saying it was a limited run. Will you so easily be able to use battlefleet gothic ships in your games of 30/40k? Sure Necromuda may include new cultist or inquisitor models but again you'll be required to spend over $100 just to have access to those models to use in your standard 30/40k game. As always, different strokes for different folks.
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Post by chaoscraig on Dec 15, 2015 4:30:08 GMT -5
I'm holding out hope that it slows down the rampant growth rate of 40k.
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Post by nogle on Dec 15, 2015 7:14:44 GMT -5
Just wait before you give up. They are going to do this right. Forge world does things right.
Btw, only got the assassins game because it was half off at Daboyz GT and I won an award so it only cost me $15.
Kevin, you should get calth. The models are so awesome, you'll love it. Plus we are working on some 30k campaign stuff over the next year or two with multiple gaming groups. Word bearers, of all 30k armies, work great with 40k models so you have a great head start on people.
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Post by grubnards on Dec 15, 2015 7:24:21 GMT -5
I haven't given up on gaming or the hobby, just competitive playing. I get it that GW is a company that wants to make money but these past couple of years have just been a slap in the face to long time customers. I guess I'm so pissed because like many of you I love the game, hobby and fluffy and have invested so much time and money on it that seeing what they have done/become feels nothing short of a kick in the balls.
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Post by nogle on Dec 15, 2015 9:20:28 GMT -5
really, the ultimate dick move that GW did was to make Space Hulk limited to begin with. If you really hold true to the term, wouldn't that mean they could never make that game ever again? technically the second run was a different game (had extra missions and tiles). I guess in the same vein that a board game now including the first expansion in the rereleased version (carcasonne with river expansion for example comes to mind).
Also, I don't think its fair to equate Necromunda to the assassins game. one is a board game and one is a miniature skirmish game.
Specialist games need to be supported by stores to work. there must be leagues or they will not survive
Also, not sure how I should feel about "nobody but Nogle" buying games. kinda feels like a slur, will have to check with "PC principal"
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Post by grubnards on Dec 15, 2015 9:35:35 GMT -5
Just having fun with you Nogle. It seems like when ever anyone brings up anything about a GW project you chime in on how you bought a copy. Again, no slight against you. I wish I still had the same enthusiasm you have for the game. But back onto the subject of specialist games, I read this article the other day on Rick Priestly and his role in creating the war hammer universe. You should give it a read. unpluggedgames.co.uk/features/blood-dice-and-darkness-how-warhammer-defined-gaming-for-a-generation/
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Post by koszkamade on Dec 15, 2015 9:49:43 GMT -5
I love space hulk and played about 20+ games before i cannabalized the parts. The game is amazing though ( especially if you have the old expansions)!
Im excited to see what they may do with the older games. Even if they make one-of board games for necromunda or BFG there's nothing wrong with using the old rule sets like we've always been saying. I just love when GW expands model ranges. I love then new clash box, but yeah, it's most;y to supplement my 40k stuff ( I'm probably going to by a second box. So many awesome models to help expand my factions!).
Kevin, don't give way to despair yet! The next chaos book will probably be brutal. In the meantime, check out imperial armor 13. The chaos upgrades and new options are amazing!!!
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Post by nogle on Dec 15, 2015 10:04:00 GMT -5
Yeah, maybe. Bought space hulk and calth the day they came out. Dreadfleet and assassin game I never planned on buying, but fell across awesome deals. Though I haven't played either of them.
I'm in a very similar place with you on tournaments right now, I played in the least amount of tournaments I've played in at least ten years this year. It costs me almost a full weeks allowance to go by the end and I get my ass kicked. Plus my army is either illegal (30k) or I'm a dick for switching marine codices with the army.
This is where specialist games are great, no really crazy army lists(unless noobs run across grizzled vet gangs/teams). And a story, maybe even a newsletter
Btw, I usually comment on new gw stuff because I read about it online(all my internet is gw/walking dead). I read the army lists people put up here most times, it's like a foreign language. I have nothing to add except maybe fluff/character changes, and no one wants to hear about that in a competitive army list
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Post by grubnards on Dec 15, 2015 10:45:44 GMT -5
Nogle, your summation in the last post pretty much mirrors my thoughts as well.
Part of the appeal to earlier editions was that I could walk into millennium on any given night with a 1850 point list and play a pick up game against someone else. Now with formations, data slates, and all these extras getting thrown around its harder to just play pick up games.
People laugh when I say that 40k is slowly getting the AoS treatment but look at the latest rules and formations coming out. Now some armies get free units for taking a certain build or armies get bonus universal rules for taking another build, all done regardless to any thought of balance.
So again, how can I possibly think that they would treat their specialist games any differently when their 2 main core games are all over the place rules wise?
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Post by nogle on Dec 15, 2015 11:39:17 GMT -5
Because they aren't doing them, forgeworld is. From the days of the warhound titan through mass ig tanks up to 30k, FW gives fans what they want.
The one game that I think will stay the most the same is blood bowl. The game is almost perfect and the video games have a mode where you just play the board game.
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Post by nogle on Dec 15, 2015 11:41:57 GMT -5
That being said, on the 40k side, I'm going to try to figure out a competative list with mostly what I own this upcoming year. Got 10k painted with 11k on deck
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